“She won’t tell us anything” Anna shared, on the verge of tears, “the only way to know what’s going on is to see what she posts on Instagram, if she hasn’t blocked us again.”
Bill puts a comforting arm around his wife, “we just don’t understand what’s gone wrong, she used to be such a happy and respectful kid. Never gave us anything to worry about till these past few months.”
Their daughter Brianna, now 14, brought straight A’s home on every report card, helped her mom teach the younger kids in Sunday school, and made her Dad proud. Until she passed out drunk at a party with a group of older peers a couple of months back.
I ask what she was like as a younger child; was there much conflict? Fights over chores? Disagreements about friends or homework?
Bill sits up a little taller, “nothing like that, as I said she’s always been a good kid. Plus, we’ve never allowed back talk in our house. That’s just disrespect.”
After spending some time with Brianna, who struggled to tell me which horse she wanted to work with, and watched our barn cat sleep on her jacket for over an hour before telling me she was allergic, I recall an article I recently found in the journal Child Development: Researchers from the University of Virginia found that kids who experienced their parents listening to them, and learned that it was safe to express their differing viewpoints to their parents, were 40% more likely to say no to peers when offered drugs and alcohol than the kids who did not argue with their parents.
I wonder how much of the current problems arose because Brianna didn’t want to ‘back talk’ her peers either.
Before continuing I’ll share my biases; my underlying core beliefs which you the reader are by no means required to agree with, but are relevant to this discussion.
- Firstly, I believe that to fulfill our potential as human beings and individuals, as well as to heal from trauma, loss and setback, we need to both feel and express our emotions, ideally within the context of a safe relationship.
- Secondly, I believe that people learn more from what we do than from what we say. Thus, if we use coercion or leverage to catch a reluctant horse while talking to a teenage girl about establishing boundaries with a boyfriend, we may be creating confusion. And if we tell our children to take responsibility for their actions yet never apologise to them for our own mistakes, we are probably not teaching what we intend.
- Finally, I believe that horses are sentient beings. By this I mean that horses experience and need to be allowed to express emotion; they also have opinions to share, and things to teach us. If this is true it greatly enhances the effectiveness and potential of therapies, especially those in the counselling and personal growth fields, which incorporate horses; it also increases our duty of care to our horses.
My opinions are certainly not shared by all. I recently came across an online discussion on a forum with a new horse owner asking for support with her horse, who she stated was challenging her authority. While the responses varied, all but one shared a theme: “Grab a lunge whip and work the crap out of him … when you control his feet, you control the horse” was one recommendation. Another stated: “All you have to do is force him to do something… (what you do) depends on how much convincing he needs.” And then, ‘No begging, no pleading, just flat out ride-’em-till-they-lick … get your adrenaline up, scream, holler, and yell. Be the alpha!’
One response, ridiculed later in the discussion, was different:
“I suggest and lead.
I teach and help.
I spend time with them and build trust.
I listen.”
I wondered which line of advice she chose to follow; and whether any of her advisers were also parents.
“When a horse is scared or overwhelmed they often respond with one of the five F’s”, our equine professional, Sue Falkner March, shared with a recent training group at Healing Hooves, “Flight, fight, freeze, faint and fidget.” Most of my participants had heard of the first three, but faint and fidget they were less familiar with. Sue continued, “Fidget is often seen as disrespect, as a behavioural problem to fix, but it’s usually our horse telling us he is concerned.”
I think of Pickle, who came from a high stress show barn environment with a warning that he likes to chew things. Early days I’d occasionally leave bridles within reach and he would cower, anticipating reprimand, when he invariably took a nibble. Now we keep leather things out of his reach and give him his own ‘chew rope’ to chow down on when he needs to. Most importantly we pay attention when he fidgets and do all we can to help him feel safe. The message this gives our clients, especially those diagnosed with ADHD and anxiey, is often very needed. I wonder what message the kids at the show barn, who saw Pickle smacked over the nose for ‘disrespectful behaviour’, took home.
The learnings and parallels also come from the other direction. In an article about parenting sensitive children, Dr. Deborah McNamara writes:
“When they feel coerced and controlled, they can become full of counterwill – the instinct behind resistance and opposition. They can dig in with refusal and lash out in frustration when attempts are made to move them in a particular direction. The goal is to engage their attention and collect them before making commands and demands so that they will be more inclined to follow along.” http://macnamara.ca/portfolio/what-sensitive-kids-would-like-you-to-know-about-them/
Anyone who has ever tried to get a sensitive or fearful horse into a horse trailer without first spending some time connecting and building trust with that horse, is likely to relate to that statement!
At Healing Hooves, we believe there are many rich parallels from the horse world which can, if we let them, teach us about ourselves and help us be better humans. We strive to draw on and practice insightful and gentle horsemanship and horse wisdom to help people. Sometimes the lessons seem obvious, right in front of us, perhaps as in the examples above.
Other times we have blind spots, when we all need to take our time and listen more carefully.
A retired showjumper showed me one of my blind spots many years ago, with the help of another 14-year-old girl, Amanda. On the streets, sexually exploited, and addicted to multiple drugs by age 12, by the time she was referred to Healing Hooves Amanda was in recovery but experiencing overwhelming anxiety. At that time Skye was my ‘anxiety horse’. With his own trauma history, high sensitivity and gentleness with people, I just knew Skye could help Amanda.
But out in the pasture Skye uncharacteristically moved away and Amanda’s eyes lit up as she asked, “who is that gorgeous black horse?” While there was no denying Dubh’s beauty, his temperament was not what I thought Amanda needed, so I steered her back in Skye’s direction.
Three sessions later not much was happening with Skye, and Amanda was still gazing at Dubh. So, we brought him in.
I shared a little of Dubhs story; his short, initially successful, show jumping career followed by early retirement for ‘behavioural problems’. Dubh’s ears pinned back as I brushed his tummy and I explained that he still struggled with touch in a number of areas, perhaps due to old injuries, or perhaps due to how he was treated. We were still trying to figure that out.
Amanda looked into Dubh’s eyes and gently stroked his neck. “Did they ever ask if you even wanted to jump?” Dubh lowered his head and Amanda scratched him behind his ears, her next words for me. “They didn’t care about him, and they never listened when he tried to say no. All they cared about was how much money he could make for them.” The latter part of Amanda’s words are muffled by Dubh’s mane and her own tears but I was finally listening. I don’t know if Amanda had Dubh’s story completely right, but I was ready to hear hers, as was Dubh.
I think back to the comment on that equine forum:
“I spend time with them and build trust. I listen.”
I learned to listen a little better that day.
Does this mean that anything goes? Am I suggesting we let our kids and horses do what they want, when and how they want, without limit and restriction?
Absolutely not! My horses, and my children, have shown me repeatedly that they feel safer and more confident when I am clearly in the lead, which sometimes means saying no, setting limits and giving direction. But I try to do so quietly and gently, listening to and for their input, and often adjusting my requests and guidance accordingly.
Similarly, the kids who the University of Virginia researchers found to be thriving were not the ones who yelled and dominated passive parents; nor were they those who whined, threatened or used insults to try to get their own way. Rather, they were the ones who were invited and encouraged by parents to express themselves – including on points of disagreement with their parents – calmly and persuasively.
Brianna and I bring Pickle into the arena, unclipping his lead rope so he can wander around and check out his surroundings. “Why is his rope like that?” Bill asks. He hands Brianna a brush and together with Anna they wait for Pickle to come back to be groomed.
“That’s a great question,” I respond.
I’m hopeful for this family. I’m hopeful that, like Pickle, Brianna will gradually find the courage to tell her parents, and her peers, what she is thinking and feeling. I’m hopeful that her parents are ready and willing to listen, even if they don’t agree with or like all they will hear.
As L.R. Knost put it so beautifully in the words of a child in one of her gentle parenting memes:
“Wait. So you want me to grow into an adult who thinks for myself, acts independently, and stand by my choices, but while I’m a child you want me to be submissive, compliant and pliable? I think we need to talk.” https://www.facebook.com/littleheartsbooks/
I think so too.
Thank you for sharing your stories of your wonderful work Sue. Your clients are lucky to be able to be with your herd and be heard.
Thank you Susan!
I loved reading this article.
Great! I’m glad you liked it Jacqueline! Have you had a chance to read some of our other articles also?
I have read many of the articles now Sue and have enjoyed all of them. I have found ways to integrate them in daily life and practice!
I’m glad you a knowledge that horses and children need a leader. Someone who sets boundaries and limits. Without that not only will your children be ‘out of control’ but you can make your horse unsafe to be around.
Thank you for sharing this heartfelt story Sue. Your article is a good reminder of how important it is to listen and build trust with our children and animal friends.
I really enjoyed this article! I have been reading Hold on to Yout Kids by Gordon Neufeld and Garbor Mate and I am so excited how you have incorporated this attachment theory into your work.
That’s so true, I love this parenting style!
I think I believed I didn’t have “a voice” as a child and it is taking time to heal from that misconception. It’s fascinating to read explanations behind some of the feelings. Thanks, Sue.
I loved this post! The context is similar with the statement that ‘children are meant to be seen not heard,’ or parents that respond with ‘do it because I said so, I’m your [mother/father/grandparent]’. So how can we encourage parents to listen and respect their children’s opinions and point of view while maintaining healthy boundaries and guidelines?
This is such a moving article. It is a reminder for me that I can create change while being gentle and firm. I tend to avoid setting limits because of fears that I won’t be heard, or else will come across as overly harsh. This was a great example for how the right person or horse can make it safe enough to explore and learn about these parts of oneself. Thanks.
“I spend time with them and build trust. I listen.”
This is very profound to me and stands out to me quite a bit. This was a great read.
Yes – that statement really stood out for me too. Sadly, it was the one which many of the other people in that particular discussion thread/ forum ridiculed.
Thank you for the wonderful article Sue. I have an ottb mare that cribs, she is an ex race horse and has this bad habit from her days on the track. I have had lots of unsolicited advise about collars and different methods to keep her from cribbing. So can understand the forum on the ‘naughty’ pony. Everyone has a quick remedy to suggest, but if we work with the horse and listen we will get further.
Great story about taking time, listening, building trust and being kind but firm with boundaries.
Loved this article. I am constantly working to ensure I am listening to both my horses and my own kids and although I don’t get it right all the time I am getting better and better every day.
sounds good Ellen – and remember you don’t need to get it right all the time – that’s not realistic for any of us!
Love this article as I think any of us can relate whether parent horse owners human beings! to find the balance of boundaries but being respectful about the boundaries to allow freedom.of thoughts emotions and behavior
Wow, a lot of people could benefit from this post! It also does a great job highlighting all the differing perspectives both in the horse world and the parenting world.
please feel free to share it Chloe!
Another great article Sue! Thank you for sharing these stories, they are so beneficial in helping me to wrap my head around what a session might look like!
Thanks, Sue. This makes me think of the set of parents I am working with right now. The dad keeps saying, “She keeps telling us but we weren’t listening.” The impact of the parents starting to listen (as well as some other changes) has been incredible.
That is so wonderful to hear Kellee – I’m glad they have you there to support them!
Powerful stuff, “did they ever ask you if you wanted to jump” !
This article is one I especially want to review right now as my evolving practice is working with horses at various stables that are leased for case by case basis. This means that interactions they have outside of sessions they have diverse experiences.
In applying principles of sentience I can only apply portions to their life in the window of time I have with the horses.
Ideally I’d love to have my own place and be the Herd manager that can make those decisions to meet the horses emotional needs for a broader time frame.
I think in my course of development though acknowledging the horses needs and honoring them is my best example at this time to create that example of listening to others and role model for clients.
Horses have amazing memories. In the short time that I am restarting some Equine Assisted Interactions I note how the horses show signs to me that they acknowledge when I acknowledge their communication of needs to be met and stress signals. I think that can help develop an indirect way of experiential enrichment for clients and theraputic learning.
This is a great reminder about the importance of listening respectfully. Whether that is within families, with our animals, or clients, listening is fundamental to building relationships and trust. Modelling behavior is also important and I see why it is so necessary to model appropriate behavior with our animals as we do with our clients. It is so easy to forget how messaging to clients and animals can come out in so many ways.
two wonderful points Anne!
Ahhh, this was phenomenal. Equine Facilitate Wellness in action, in my opinion. Thanks so much for sharing.
you are welcome Sara! I find that case examples are one of the best ways to understand the power of this work and approach!
I was previously going to comment on Pickle’s self regulation through rope chewing or the “fidget” tool available to him
Sue, mastering the tools and skills needed to be a great listener is the greatest of all gifts, for both the one sharing as for the one listening. I have dedicated much of my personal and professional practice to the art and science of listening. It is my hope that more people learn to listen, more deeply, to themselves and then to others. 🙂
I agree so much! This is beautiful! I also love the article on sensitive kids.
Great article. I really like the quote “spend time build trust and listen” I think this is key to working with horses and people.
In my mind messages out there about behavior and expectations have outweighed the messages about having our feelings, connecting with our children and the ones that need our care… many parents that I see in counselling feel overwhelmed with the feelings their children have and feel they have little guidance about what to do with them. And I think there’s confusion about it, if we welcome feelings it seems to suggest we disregard healthy behaviors or something. Like the two cannot co-exist. I appreciate you sharing the forum conversation, about the one who suggested to listen and lead, that is such a good example. Finding our way through this to a place where we can welcome children/clients to come to the table with their thoughts, feelings, opinions, hopes, dreams…this is where I want to be, with my own children and with my clients. Even helping my puppy through the process of respecting her and guiding her to good behavior has been confusing at times. but worth the work. 🙂
Great article! It certainly is difficult as a parent to strike a balance between having firm boundaries and expectations, while inviting our children to express their emotions and opinions. It reminds me of the article we read in Explorations on being a worthy leader. A worthy leader doesn’t lead with the goal of eliciting certain behaviours at all costs, but leads with the goal of helping someone (animal or person) to feel safest when following. I’d like to explore more deeply how we can apply this to our role as parents or when working in a professional context with kids and families.
Thanks Andrea! This is definitely something we dive into in more depth in the Foundation training!
I really enjoyed this article!! I love the commentary on expectations for our children and how dramatically they shift when they cross the threshold into adulthood and what galena when we haven’t given them the skills in childhood to meet those adult expectations. I often reflect on whether my parental expectations are too make my life easier or to set my child up for success. I love how the comment spend time build trust and listen is so wonderfully applicable to both parenting and horsemanship. Thanks for this insightful article.
I have seen many battles with people trying to get horses on the trailer. This article reminds me of the time our horse, who normally went on a wide variety of trailers just fine, did not want to load onto a trailer we had acquired more recently. We were perplexed, but after listening to him, we figured out he did not feel comfortable going through the narrow opening. When we open up the tack compartment area just a few extra inches, he went right on without a second thought. Taking time to listen is so important.
this is a great example of taking some time to understand the why behind a behaviour, rather than reacting to it blindly! This could be a good story to build into sessions!
I appreciate your honesty in relating the story with Amanda and Dubh. This point reminded me that not only will I need to listen to the animal, but to remember that the client’s intuition and autonomy are just as important. Instincts work for all species and it will be important to listen for the messages from all participants in the room equally.
yes – I agree Charis – it is so key for us to listen to all parties in these sessions. I actually have just discovered and bought a kids book called “Listen’ which expresses this beautifully!
I’m grateful for several themes in this post. First, the recognition of “fidget” as an anxiety response is helpful. I have a few in the herd that fidget quite a bit during in-hand programs. I assumed it was boredom. This has given me pause to reconsider this behaviour as a stress response. The second theme on trusting our horses and clients in terms of selection and pairing is so important and while it can be somewhat systematised based on our personal deep connections with the herd, surprise is okay. When I’ve erred in the other direction – placing too much weight on the clients choice rather than trusting that I know the personal disposition of that horse to be a poor fit, but trying to make it work for the client anyway… that kind of situation really stinks – when you say to yourself, “Red” is not going to like this one tiny bit, but the client insists they have or want a connection, and you end up being right… “Red” hated every moment… I find that way harder to take than the opposite.
yes, I think that fidgit response is very often misinterpreted! You raise a good point re horse choice – this is something we explore often through examples at the training. Definitely allowing the horse the option to say no would be my recommendation but there then needs to be lots of consideration re how this impacts the client and how to debrief and proces sthis!
Found this article really made me think about my own parenting and how often I heard the phrase “children should be seen and not heard” from my own grandmother as a young child and the subtle way this probably still influences me today. Sadly too often I think I probably just want my children to do as I ask (as I love them and being full of good intentions believe this is best) however often rushing from one activity / school / work etc to the next so guilty of not even explaining why or listening well when they are resistant to my plans for them. Not really helping them in the long run.
Thank you for sharing this learning moment Sue! For me, this was a very moving post.
Thanks for this article Sue. Such a wonderful reminder to balance knowledge and experience with openness and curiosity.
Very heart-felt story. Reminds me to trust the clients lead at times while tending to the relationships and safety.
Found this article really made me think about my own parenting and how often I heard the phrase “children should be seen and not heard” from my own grandmother as a young child and the subtle way this probably still influences me today. Sadly too often I think I probably just want my children to do as I ask (as I love them and being full of good intentions believe this is best) however often rushing from one activity / school / work etc to the next so guilty of not even explaining why or listening well when they are resistant to my plans for them. Not really helping them in the long run.
We will actually come back to the piece about ‘explaining why’ in our section on frustration. I remember being determined to never say anything like ‘because I said so’ when my kids questioned a boundary or a ‘no’ – but there is actually a time and a place for giving explanations – we explore this when we look at the emotion of frustration and developmental process of adaptation!
I think this story tests us all such an important lesson! How important it is to actually HEAR what is being said and not just listen. Even though we may be the expert, we should always be open to learning and growing ourselves. Lessons come from everywhere. I love that even though that young girl felt she could not express herself to the adults or peers in her life, she still held empathy and understanding for those around her.